Two Saitek Quadrants

[liderpz]

Hi,
Let me tell you an issue that comes back to me from time to time.
In my configuration, I have got a joystick, a yoke, pedals and two Saitek quadrants. One of my quadrants is configured to control spoiler axis and throttle 1. The other one controls throttle 2 and flaps axis.
Everything goes like a charm. But, from time to time, one of the quadrants loses its configuration, and becomes identical in axes and buttons to the other one.
Both Quadrants have exactly the same name as Windows does not allow, afaik, any change. I suppose that internal bindings are made by Prepar3D thru each quadrant device ID.
This issue came when I ran windows 7, and previous versions of Prepar3D. Now I'm running windows 10, and Prepar3D 4.5 hotfix 2, and no change. From time to time, it arises...
I can infere that it has something to do with the fact I have got two devices exactly alike. Maybe someone is able to explain to me how is the internal mecanism used to assign keys and axes to my devices, and hopefully, he/she can find an explanation for this behaviour. Or even a workaround.
Thanks in advance, Luis ;-)

[JorgenSA]

Luis,

I don't know too much about these quadrants, but I think that you are on the right track when you (as I see it) suspect the issue maybe arises from them having the same name.

Have you talked to Saitek about how this maybe can be changed? Because I believe that a utility like FSUIPC, that is able to change the assignments, will require unique names for the devices.....

Pete Dowson in the FSUIPC forums might also be able to shed some light upon this.

Jorgen

[liderpz]

Thanks Jorgen,
Yes, we are in the same page, but, IMHO, devices should be identified by their IDs. I know Windows assigns a different ID to each device (HID, or associated USB), so when it connects to a specific device (e.g. for calibration purposes), it always knows which is which.
I don't know if I could get the same problems with FSUIPC (I didn't in the past). And I appreciate (much) your advise as it is a workaround, but this actually is a question for LM support, as Prepar3D should not lose its configuration.
If LM confirms there is no solution available, then I shall be forced to work it out with FSUIPC.
Again, thanks ;-)

[JorgenSA]

I think you definitely should talk to Saitek about this, if you haven't already. They might have some ideas.

Jorgen

[liderpz]

I shall do but, first of all, I want to get an official LM support opinion about the issue.
Thanks ;-)

[JorgenSA]

Luis,

With all respect, I suggest you get in contact with Saitek. Since the quadrants are not made by L-M, it is not up to L-M to support the quadrants or insure their compatibility with P3D, that is up to Saitek alone.

Jorgen

[Martyson]

Luis,

With all respect, I suggest you get in contact with Saitek. Since the quadrants are not made by L-M, it is not up to L-M to support the quadrants or insure their compatibility with P3D, that is up to Saitek alone.

Jorgen

Jorgen,

Saitek is a Prepar3D Developer Network Partner:
https://www.prepar3d.com/developers/

[JorgenSA]

Still a Saitek issue.

Jorgen

[Martyson]

Still a Saitek issue.

Jorgen

I have Saitek Yoke/ 2 Saitek throttles quads, no issues with any versions of P3D past or present on my setup.

[JorgenSA]

So, here's a question for you then, Vaughan:

Do these 2 quadrants have different names on your system? If you go back to Luis' posts, you will see that his have the same names - which might be root cause of his problem.

If they have different names, was that then something that you changed, or did they get different names on installation?

And another question: might there be updated drivers available for these quadrants?

Jorgen

[Martyson]

So, here's a question for you then, Vaughan:

Do these 2 quadrants have different names on your system? If you go back to Luis' posts, you will see that his have the same names - which might be root cause of his problem.

If they have different names, was that then something that you changed, or did they get different names on installation?

And another question: might there be updated drivers available for these quadrants?

Jorgen

Jorgen,

The OP replied to your previous post saying:
"I shall do but, first of all, I want to get an official LM support opinion about the issue."

[JorgenSA]

We are going around in a circle here.

The scope of L-M tech support is to support L-M products, in this case P3D. Support of other products, in this case the Saitek quadrants, is NOT in the scope of L-M tech support, but is in the scope of Saitek tech support.

It has been drilled into me in my career in tech support that you do not support another company's products, because:

1. You don't know their product as well as they do

2. The legal ramifications (you are actually encroaching into another company's territory)

3. You are not being paid to do so

What you CAN do is give advice, but always follow that up with: "Talk to their tech support and see what they say"

So, where did I learn all this, or did I come up with that on my own?

Well, the first equipment manufacturer I worked for was Reveal (sound cards and multimedia kits back in the mid-90s), when I lived in the L.A. area. I left them for Quarterdeck in 1995, and became lead tech for QEMM and Cleansweep, and taught the art of tech support. In 2000 I joined another company (a large one) that I cannot mention, because they still exist, and there the rules of the scope of tech support were rigidly and strictly applied for the 3 above reasons.

So, that is why I offer advice to Luis, but also follow it up by "Talk to Saitek".

The advice we give to Luis would be enhanced if you could answer the question I posed to you.

And, Vaughan, please do not take this personally. You give great advice and solve problems for a lot of people. Please note that I am trying to do the same thing, we just have 2 different approaches to that.

Damn, this got a bit long -

Jorgen

[Martyson]

Jorgen,

The OP posted the topic:
“Two Saitek Quadrants”

You replied by saying:
“I don't know too much about these quadrants”

Later the OP replied to your guidance by saying:
“I shall do but, first of all, I want to get an official LM support opinion about the issue.”

The OP’s reply sounded perfectly good to me.

[JorgenSA]

Certainly it is... but I highly doubt such a reply or statement from L-M is going to come, given the reasons I outlined above.

That is why Luis might want to follow plan B and talk to Saitek.

Jorgen

[Martyson]

Luis,
You initially mentioned:
“Let me tell you an issue that comes back to me from time to time.
In my configuration, I have got a joystick, a yoke, pedals and two Saitek quadrants.”

You did not mention the product brand name of your joystick, yoke, and pedals or how the devices are installed.

I assume your two Saitek Throttle Quads are part of a Standard Saitek Yoke setup with one dedicated Saitek Throttle quad connected to the Saitek yoke and a second Optional Saitek Throttle Quad (two throttle quads total with 3 axes each).

Or possibly your setup is a custom setup mixing Saitek products (2 optional Saitek throttle quads) with another manufacturers Yoke.


In your setup Saitek and P3D (plus joystick / pedals etc) are ok and working most of the time.
I assume, other times the OS (Win7 prior or WIN10 now) looks at your setup, see a problem and changes your USB port assignments.


Questions on your setup:
What are the product brand names for your joystick, yoke, and pedals?

Are you using a Standard Saitek Yoke setup with one dedicated Saitek Throttle quad connected to the Saitek yoke and a second Optional Saitek Throttle Quad (two throttle quads total with 3 axes each).

Or is your setup mixing Saitek products, e.g., two Optional Saitek throttle quads with another manufacturers Yoke?

Does your PC setup include a USB Hub (unpowered or powered)?
Do you use any of the 3 USB ports on the Saitek Yoke (I assumed a Saitek Pro Yoke?)?
Do all of your Saitek USB cables (Yoke / throttles) plug directly to your PC’s USB ports/sockets?
As for your USB Joystick, Rudders, Yoke (e.g., not Saitek) do they all plug directly to your PC’s USB ports/sockets?
Do you use any USB extension cables in your PC setup for any of your USB device?