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Author Topic: Turboprop CN1
WarpD
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Post Turboprop CN1
on: May 19, 2012, 13:01

What is the calculation of CN1 to CN2 for a turboprop?

The only values you can define in the .air file are in TBL1503 and TBL1504 which affect CN2 vs Throttle. How is the sim calculating CN1 in the turboprop? Near as I can tell... CN1 is a hard-coded value based on throttle position, would it be possible to get the information so I can properly set up a spreadsheet for CN1 vs throttle?

Ed Wilson

MikeSchroe-
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Lockheed Martin
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Post Re: Turboprop CN1
on: May 21, 2012, 12:43

AIR_70_MACH_0_CORRECTED_COMMANDED_NE and AIR_70_MACH_HI_CORRECTED_COMMANDED_NE are the .air file tokens associated with CN1. See SDK sample TurboPropSample.asm for explanation. These two tables effectively map calculate a commanded corrected N1 based on throttle, mach, and atmospheric pressure ratio.

Hope this helps,
Mike

WarpD
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Post Re: Turboprop CN1
on: May 21, 2012, 15:32

Yes... those are the 1503 and 1504 I referred to... they do not affect the value of CN1 as reported by the sim variable TURB_ENGINE_1_CORRECTED_N1. At least, I see no change. CN1 is still restricted to 66% to 101.5% no matter what I do with the values in those two tables.

Am I perhaps missing something?

MikeSchroe-
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Lockheed Martin
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Post Re: Turboprop CN1
on: May 21, 2012, 17:02

Yeah, looking a little closer at the code... those tables basically set a target N1 for the fuel controller, which increases/decreases fuel necessary to achieve the the target. Then N1 is linked to that fuel calc. Unfortunately, that relationship is hardcoded, which explains what you are experiencing. In effect, those tables can affect the dynamics of N1, but within that range. "fuel_flow_gain" in the .cfg is effectively the time constant on this if you're interested in adjusting rates.

Mike

WarpD
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Post Re: Turboprop CN1
on: May 21, 2012, 19:09

I was trying to correctly model the behavior of a PT6 turboprop. Unfortunately the CN1 of the sim apparently doesn't support that.
The company I work for is getting pressed hard to deliver more accurate engine behavior.

MikeSchroe-
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Lockheed Martin
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Post Re: Turboprop CN1
on: May 22, 2012, 01:24

Not that we can do anything about it right now, but what relationship is it that you need to model?

Mike

WarpD
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Post Re: Turboprop CN1
on: May 22, 2012, 11:16

The first part needed is more accurate representation of the Ng values. Dependent on what aircraft/PT6 model... Ng can range from as low as 52% to over 106%. A way to define the min/max Ng range would at the least help as it appears that there's a hard-coded min/max already so it should be a minor mod to allow for a .cfg file entry to set that versus being strictly hard coded. At least, that's my thinking... but I don't have the code in front of me. ;)

The second part deals with the fact the PT6 is a 'free running turbine'. This means the fuel flow is unaffected by prop RPMs.

MikeSchroe-
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Post Re: Turboprop CN1
on: May 22, 2012, 15:16

Yep, understood on the Ng limits. As for FF, the property TURB_ENG_CORRECTED_FF does actually work appropriately. Unfortunately, it is used as an internal state parameter within the turbine code and not directly linked to the fuel demand code. There were some legacy implementation reasons for this at the time.

Mike

WarpD
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Post Re: Turboprop CN1
on: May 22, 2012, 18:14

So are you saying that TURB_ENG_CORRECTED_FF will take into account the 'free running turbine' design?

MikeSchroe-
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Lockheed Martin
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Post Re: Turboprop CN1
on: May 22, 2012, 20:40

Yes, but it's only used as a intermediate term within the turbine calculations. It is not used for the actual fuel consumption. You'll have to choose if you want the indication to be more appropriate or if the fuel consumption should correspond exactly with this rate.

WarpD
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Post Re: Turboprop CN1
on: May 23, 2012, 09:47

Ok... so what you're saying is if I display TURB_ENG_CORRECTED_FF... it will accurately reflect fuel flow conditions per a 'free running turbine'... but it will not accurately reflect actual fuel consumption?

MikeSchroe-
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Post Re: Turboprop CN1
on: May 23, 2012, 11:32

No, because it is not linked to the fuel demand code - that's separate code. Choose your poison ;-)

WarpD
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Post Re: Turboprop CN1
on: May 24, 2012, 21:50

At this point... color me confused.
If I choose to use TURB_ENG_CORRECTED_FF... it's values will accurately reflect fuel burn usage for a free running turbine, or not?

MikeSchroe-
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Lockheed Martin
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Post Re: Turboprop CN1
on: May 25, 2012, 12:15

No, it is not intended to be used for fuel consumption calculations. It is only there to model a fuel controller to in the relationship between commanded N1 and actual N1. Independently, we model fuel flow for purposes of fuel consumption. In modeling and tuning dependent relationships like this, it sometimes helps to separate things a bit so that one can tune one aspect without upsetting the other. e.g. for MSFS it was important to make actual fuel burn more tunable, without secondarily affecting N1, power, etc... So, pretend "TURB_ENG_CORRECTED_FF" is named something else, but it just so happens that it sort of has the dynamics of free turbine fuel flow.
My point previously was that if your boss's training scenario is centered around cockpit procedures and familiarization, some error in the longterm fuelburn may be less of an issue than the current FF indications. But I don't know, it's only a suggestion for you to try.

Mike

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